| Author |
Message |
Barry Musmon (Oldrelayer)
New Solitaire Player
Username: Oldrelayer
Post Number: 1
Registered: 5-2007
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 09, 2007 - 11:30 am: | |
Although I suspect that FreeCell has been on one of my computers for at least 15 years probably longer, I only recently tried it. I have to say I am not one to play computer games, but I was immediately hooked on the strategic qualities of FreeCell. I started by just seeing what my percentage was and how many games I could win in a row. Then I some research, I had an idea that most if not all games were winnable, but I didn't have any data to support that theory until I found a couple of sites. I was impressed by people and there are some right here that have been through all 31999 winnable games. So I started all over again, just taking them as they came up and solving them and not going on till what I am working on is solved. So far that is a pretty small number, just turned 90. I then saw game 1941 was a challenge even for those way more experienced than I, I have given it a couple of tries, but probably will leave that one until it comes up in my rotation, then I will be obligated to solve it before going on, boy hats off to the people that can spend months or even years solving a game. I haven't figured out the notation yet to get some hints, and at this point until I get one that is really killer, I probably will go my own way. Just wanted to say hello to my fellow Masochistic game players.
Thanks,
Barry |
Richard Mechen (Richardscotland)
Master Solitaire Player
Username: Richardscotland
Post Number: 696
Registered: 9-2006
| | Posted on Thursday, May 10, 2007 - 6:37 am: | |
Hi Barry, On behalf of the silent majority, and the frequently outspoken minority, ie me, welcome to the forum.
PGS appears to have slightly more Freecell games than you're expecting. 2147483647 to be precise. As I said recently to Mike Butler, if you played 100 games per day for the next 50 years, you'd need 1175 mates doing likewise to get through them all. I'd like to be the first to wish you good luck! So much for that idea huh?
If you get stuck with any particular number in whatever game you're playing, just post it in the "Is It Winnable" section and I'm sure someone will be able to help you.
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Thomas Warfield (Support)
Moderator
Username: Support
Post Number: 1141
Registered: 12-2002
| | Posted on Saturday, May 12, 2007 - 12:20 pm: | |
Barry,
The first 32000 games have been pretty extensively explored, since they've been in Windows since 1995. The games up to one million are only more recently included in Windows and the difficult/easy ones haven't been as closely identified. If you want to do something that hasn't been done, finding impossible games over one million is an area that hasn't been explored very much yet.
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Barry Musmon (Oldrelayer)
New Solitaire Player
Username: Oldrelayer
Post Number: 2
Registered: 5-2007
| | Posted on Thursday, May 17, 2007 - 5:27 am: | |
Hello Thomas. Thanks for the post. Well there is some security in knowing that the game is solvable, that is when I changed my strategy to trying to win as many of the winnable games as possible. Right now sitting at 122 without having to pass on a game. My game doesn't even have more than 32000 at the moment. However, if I was to work with like 10 other players each having a crack at the hardest games, much like what was done with the first 32000 that would be interesting. I am pretty much at my limit after 2 or 3 tries when I don't know if it is winnable, but on the other hand I have more fortitude when I know a game is winnable. So if there is such a group of people, I would have a tendency to join them. Although I am 62, so it would be doubtful I would ever see it through to its completion which could take several years longer than I have. Has anyone written a program to see how many of these are duplicate games?
Thanks,
Barry
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Gregg Seelhoff (Seelhoff)
Master Solitaire Player
Username: Seelhoff
Post Number: 269
Registered: 1-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, May 17, 2007 - 4:09 pm: | |
>Has anyone written a program to see how many of these are duplicate games?
There are 2147483647 FreeCell deals (2^31 - 1) in Pretty Good Solitaire, which is certainly a big number, but compared to the number of possible deals, 52! (around 8.066 x 10^67), it is fairly insignificant.
In fact, I think that the raw chance (barring coding or logic errors) of any two deals in PGS being the same is less than one billionth of a percent, so I am not sure that such a program would be worthwhile. (It would take 78Gb just to store all of the deals in a compact format.)
Of course, I could certainly be wrong. 
My answer to your actual question, though, is that I am unaware of any such program.
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Barry Musmon (Oldrelayer)
New Solitaire Player
Username: Oldrelayer
Post Number: 3
Registered: 5-2007
| | Posted on Thursday, May 17, 2007 - 6:37 pm: | |
Thanks Gregg for the post. Your logic is sound, with those kind of odds, I guess I don't have to worry about solving a hard game more than once.
I guess I will continue on my present course until I find a group that I can work toward a systematic approach to solving some of the higher games. Winning all winnable games in the first 32000 seems like crossing the Atlantic in a row boat, where 2 million would be like swimming it, pretty sure you would drown first.
Thanks,
Barry
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Gregg Seelhoff (Seelhoff)
Master Solitaire Player
Username: Seelhoff
Post Number: 273
Registered: 1-2003
| | Posted on Friday, May 18, 2007 - 1:36 am: | |
>Your logic is sound, with those kind of odds, I guess I don't have to worry about solving a hard game more than once.
No, I do not think you should worry. Of course, the human mind is expert at recognizing patterns, so after a while, one begins to detect similarities in deals. This is, in my opinion, a sign that one is starting to really understand FreeCell.
>I guess I will continue on my present course until I find a group that I can work toward a systematic approach to solving some of the higher games.
I simply started at deal #1 and worked my way up, and I am still far from #11982, the first/lowest unsolvable deal. At just over 3300 games won, it will be a long time before I have to worry about that.
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Barry Musmon (Oldrelayer)
Junior Solitaire Player
Username: Oldrelayer
Post Number: 4
Registered: 5-2007
| | Posted on Friday, May 18, 2007 - 8:05 am: | |
I still take the radom game and have an excell spead sheet. I have 131 games solved in this manner, plus about 50 before I started really tracking them. I have a long way to go to get to where you are, but life is about the journey not the final destination, which is of course death. |
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